When did you meet Terry Nichols and Michael Fortier?
They were all in basic training together. That’s where we all first met.
Are they close friends [of yours]?
I’d say yes,
After you got out of the service you visited them and stayed in contact.
Yes, I continued to stay in contact with them.
What about the recent claims from Fortier that you allegedly cased the federal building together last December?
Now, wait a second. I don’t know that Fortier’s made any such claims. That’s a report.
I’ve been through Oklahoma City.
With Michael Fortier?
I think I’d rather not answer that.
It’s very common when a guy comes back from a war to have kind of a postwar hangover. Do you think you were experiencing that?
I think it was delayed in my case. I understand the feeling you’re relating, that there’s a natural adrenaline, you’re way up and then it’s way down when it’s over. . . . I think it did hit when everyone did get out.
It’s been reported that Terry [Nichols] and Tim played with demolitions on the farm in Michigan.
It would amount to firecrackers.
You were just having fun?
It was like popping a paper bag,
What were [the explosives] made out of?
They were plastic Pepsi [bottles] that burst because of air pressure. Again, it was like popping a paper bag.
But was it an ammonium-nitrate mix of some sort?
I don’t know that I want to confirm that I know of any chemicals or anything else.
How have you been treated since you’ve been in the slammer?
I’d say that I’m being treated very well. I do have a tough time wondering what fights I should have at this time, being presumed innocent yet being incarcerated pretrial, and being a nonfelon.
There is a report that you’ve confessed to the crime.
I can dearly deny that.
What about the allegation that [when arrested] you gave only your name, rank and serial number and that you called yourself a prisoner of war?
I never, never called myself a prisoner of war.
I think we also should put on the record that you asked for an armored vest when they took you out of the jail.
Oh. yes, I specifically requested [that]. I could see the buildup of the crowd outside and I knew what the situation was and I specifically requested an armored vest. They said they’d work on it. And of course you’ve seen the picture corning out of the court-house–they’re all standing at arm’s length away from me.
Did they give you any explanation?
They only said we’d work on it, and they never mentioned it again.
Did your memory bank spin up visions of Oswald?
Yes, yes.
Did they show you any photo- graphs of the victims of the bombing?
Yes.
The children?
Yes.
What was your reaction?
At that point I had requested to speak to an attorney, so therefore i was not going to respond to them further.
When did you realize the place had been blown up, the scope of it, the number of casualties?
The first place I heard [about it] was in the car with Trooper [Charlie] Hanger. He mentioned that he was supposed to go down to the city. . . because of this massive explosion that they had yet to determine –this was his words- they had yet to determine the source of.
So any reaction- even in hindsight –to the children being such large numbers of victims?
For two days, in the cell, we could hear news reports, and of course everyone, including myself, was horrified at the deaths of the children. And you know, that was the No. 1 focal point of the media at the time, too, obviously–the deaths of the children. It’s a very tragic thing.
It’s been reported that the [Waco] siege made you angry.
I would say bothered. And it must have bothered many people.
Do you think the government made mistakes?
Most definitely.
There are reports that you’ve been a member of the Michigan Militia.
Those are false reports.
You don’t belong to any [militia] organizations?
No, and I was never to one of their meetings, either.
This is the question that everybody wants to know–Did you do it?
The only way we can really answer that is that we are going to plead not guilty.
And we’re going to go to triM.
But you’ve got a chance fight now to say “Hell no!”
Well, but that. . .
We can’t do that.
And if he says “Hell, no,” the government isn’t going to just [say] “Well, OK, that settles that.”
What do you think the outcome of the case will be?
I can’t really speculate on that. Time will tell. But I think this is one of the largest media-coverage events in a long time, and I think it will be very difficult to get a fair trial anywhere.
Are you concerned that the ultimate punishment will be the death penalty?
Yea.h, I think that’s a concern, and I think with anybody it would be.
How will you handle that?
I guess as anybody else would–one day at a time, see what develops.
